Podcast Ep192 Jeffrey Marshall
Didrik Johnck: You can't make dreams come true if the only thing you're doing is dreaming. Think about that for a moment. This is from a guy who was counted out on day one. What does that mean? Means not being included in an activity. And in this case, that activity was life itself. The doctors told his parents he wouldn't live more than a few months.
He was born without arms, almost no legs, and immediately given up for adoption. Now, decades later, he's an accomplished musician and world traveler. Growing up in Nashville was part of his musical trajectory, eventually leading to a moment in front of 20, 000 people performing his soulful style of music where Jeffrey Marshall, our guest today, became known as the guy who plays bass guitar with his feet.
Have a listen.
Music: I know you better than your daddy and I treat you like you're my best friend. I make love like Casanova and I love you like the elephant man.
Didrik Johnck: This is the No Barriers Podcast. Our host is Erik Weihenmayer, I'm producer Didrik Johnck, and as our guest likes to say, close your eyes and jump, you'll figure it out in the air. All right, let's do this.
Erik Weihenmayer: It's easy to talk about the successes, but what doesn't get talked about enough is the struggle. My name is Erik Weihenmayer. I've gotten the chance to ascend Mount Everest, to climb the tallest mountain in every continent, to kayak the Grand Canyon, and I happen to be blind. It's been a struggle to live what I call a no barriers life.
To define it, to push the parameters of what it means. And part of the equation is diving into the learning process and trying to illuminate the universal elements that exist along the way. And that unexplored terrain between those dark places we find ourselves in and the summit exists a map. That map, that way forward is what we call No Barriers.
Hey everyone. Welcome to the No Barriers Weihenmayer and my gosh, I am so excited, uh, for the next hour. Jeffrey Marshall. It's so great to get to talk to you. So I was interviewing Shawn who organizes the Shine Music Festival. And you are obviously like a huge highlight of that show amongst, among many other venues, of course.
And, I went online and started learning about you and my mind was blown. Your music is beautiful. Your band is incredible. like folk and rock and blues and, like groove and psychedelic kind of, it's just everything I love, man. It was just absolutely cool to, To, to get to know you
Jeffrey Marshall: Well. thank you Eric. I really appreciate you. You're making me blush over here. Nice. Good.
Erik Weihenmayer: Yeah. Blush away. You can blush in front of a black guy. Thank you. Anytime . Okay. Yeah.
Jeffrey Marshall: Awesome. Awesome. Yeah, no, I really appreciate, like I said, I'm a little bit of a fan boy to you. you have also. As I was saying before, a very impressive, resume, so I'm very delighted to be on your show.
Erik Weihenmayer: Yeah, sweet. I usually like warm up with like just some get to know you questions and so forth, but I guess I'm just gonna like really throw it at you right from the beginning here. So you were born,prematurely with this disability, pretty serious disability. And then, um, uh, doctors are saying, you're not, I mean, I'm, I'm, I'm laughing more out of like irony and so forth, but, they say, you're not going to live past three and now you're like 50 years old.
You're crushing it. It seems like you're living the dream in so many ways, although I know every human still has barriers no matter how successful they become. But gosh, that prediction and that, that origin story. I'm just wondering how it shapes your life framework, like how you see the world in yourself.
Like if that story must creep into your DNA. And I guess I'll blabber a little bit more here and tell you,I went blind when I was 14 years old. And so like, in my life, that loss, kind of, you know, even though I'm a super positive person, I sometimes have to fight little bits of fears of, of like, Oh gosh, am I going to lose something else in my life?
You know what I mean? I have to kind of wrestle with that framework a little bit in my life. So I'm just wondering how, that affected you and your life, your worldview,
Jeffrey Marshall: It's interesting that you ask that because it's so,in a way it's so subjective because it's I don't really have, at least in my life, I don't really have anything else to compare it to, I've always often said that, when you've been counted out in life at a very early age, you know, you and you get to a certain point, everything else is like recess time, you know, it's just, life is just there to enjoy, you just gotta, watch out for the, the bullies and, uh, make out with the girls under the bleachers kind of thing, you know?
Not every day can be a sunny day, but life is such a, a blessing. I look at just, not just my disability, but I mean, not beingin a war, not being in a war is a blessing. Or, just having freedom's not being hungry or not being cold is just a blessing.
People say like, you know, it always can be worse, but it really can always be worse. And, yeah, I just try to stay positive and, but also realistic, if I'm having a bad day, I, I embrace that bad day that I'm having, cause, uh, you know, the only people that are happy all the time are like serial killers, right?
Erik Weihenmayer: Yeah, totally. What's like a hurdle in your daily life that you still kind of wrestle with?
Jeffrey Marshall: Oh, a hurdle in my daily life.
Erik Weihenmayer: Yeah, like little things, not like the big catastrophic things, but just like little things that you got to deal with.
Jeffrey Marshall: I wouldn't say it's in my daily life because I don't,travel on a daily, fly on a daily basis.
But, one hurdle in my life that, that I had to deal with. couple of days ago is flying from point A to point B and then damaging my wheelchair.
Erik Weihenmayer: Oh my gosh.
Jeffrey Marshall: I travel, international often,and I've gotten to the places, when you go to baggage claim and they bring your wheelchair out, your electric wheelchair out in a box and they look at you like, Oh, didn't it, you know, it wasn't it in a box when you left?
And you're like, no, it wasn't in a box when I left and then oftentimes, you go to places where there's not wheelchair repair people around.That's a hurdle, but I'm fortunate that I have a wonderful wife and she takesvery good care of me.
And, but I've always had to have that, regardless of even before I was married.
Erik Weihenmayer: Traveling is a nightmare for everyone, but you know, when you're in a chair, travel has got to be a nightmare. I was on vacation and our bags were two days late, but if your wheelchair doesn't arrive or is broken, yeah.
That's serious business. And then also the way, I don't think they purposely treat you in a weird way, but, uh, if you're in a chair, I know there's a lot of just,I don't know how to say like things that you have to do to get on the plane. You don't have to jump in their narrow wheelchair and all kinds of hoops.
You got to jump through. It's a pain.
Jeffrey Marshall: Absolutely. and, things that gets really frustrating is also when, you're traveling, you're flying, and a lot of times people won't address me, they'll address my wife. And, my wife doesn't really speak English.
Erik Weihenmayer: Right.
Jeffrey Marshall: And and she's so she's always looking at me and I'm like, I can, you need to address me.
So it's like a lot of times people will just I don't think they do it on purpose or even know that they're doing it, but they maybe treat you like a child, just because they see you in a wheelchair.
Erik Weihenmayer: Yeah. Yeah. They look past you. It's hard. Yeah, exactly. What on the opposite side of that, what puts a smile on your face these days?
Are you still enjoying making music, making films, creating music and all the stuff that you do? What's the motivating factor these days?
Jeffrey Marshall: I think there's always an ebb and flow, artistically, if I'm working on a project, whether it be film or whether it be music.
The next thing that I'm doing afterward is generally something completely different than what I was doing before. And I'm always just trying to stay hungry, stay thirsty for the art. And and I think that has to, not be complacent for me, as an artist, cause I can go a thousand different directions.
And so, you know, just getting in, just doing, being involved. I mean, I love the process. I love being in the studio. I love working on a film and for 20 hours in a day, I love that. I love, that feeling of just making the, creating the, creating the art that, that, that motivates me.
I think sometimes creating the art is more gratifying than completing what a project.
Erik Weihenmayer: Hey everyone, this is Erik and I just wanna remind you that No Barriers is not just a podcast, it's also a movement and an organization. Our mission is to empower people with challenges to break through barriers, to discover purpose, and to find ways of elevating their lives and their communities.
If you want to support our work, go to NoBarriersUSA.org/donate.
I like what you're talking about, this ebb and flow, because I feel that too, in my life. Once I've completed a big project, there's always an ebb, you know. There's always like a little bit of, not a low point like where you're sad or something, but you're just like a little bit washed out, and you have to kind of, and build back up and so forth. And you have to, in a way, accept that and not completely fight that ebb and flow.
Jeffrey Marshall: Yeah. as I get older, I findI love performing. I love performing, but all the little things that you have to deal with, like dealing with the promoters, and dealing with.and, and marketing, you know, the concert and all this, and even getting the venue and setting up and doing all that.
that's that's as I get older, I'm like, why am I doing this? You know? And then, and then you perform and then you're like, Oh yeah, that's why I did that, but I see my, yeah, but it seems like I go through that a lot more as I get older, like, Oh, I don't want to do this. I don't want to perform.
I don't want to go and do all this things and have to show up, but then, the performance you're like, okay, you perform. And then after you get off stage, you're like, you want to go back on and do it again and do this forever. it's, it's just, it's, I guess it's all part of the journey and, um, and just realizing that it's all part of the journey and you've got to take the good with the bad and just make sure that you, um, you know, love what you do.
Like if I was, if I was ever on stage or,and I hated that part, then I don't think I would be doing music anymore, at least not performing music.
Erik Weihenmayer: I'm with you. I love, like, I speak for a living and I love the speaking. I love the interaction. I just hate the travel around it. I hate all the logistics around it, but yeah, you got to deal with that, right?
Uh, we were having technical difficulties earlier, before the show started. And so it's just a side question. I'm curious, have you ever had just like a techno disaster on stage where like your mic's not working or your amp's not working? I remember I was speaking on a book tour and everything catastrophically shut down. All my AV and I'm like trying to explain how I kayak rivers and I'm like pretending to kayak on stage. It was like such a disaster. You got,
Jeffrey Marshall: Oh, I, my last show was, Oh, it was, It could have been complete disaster. so I was, uh, uh, performing at a, at a fashion show. And of course the people at the fashion show, they just,they didn't plan for music. They didn't, they didn't have anything set up. You show up. Oh my gosh. Yeah, I show up and, uh, you know, and I, and I perform on a little stage, you know, cause I, I lay down and, perform with my feet. But anyway, so I have a little stage, I'll have a little platform.
I set it all up and then I had to tear it all down. So they could bring everything back up on the runway and then basically set it up and like, I don't know, a few minutes, and I had to set up all the things, set up my guitar, set up my microphone, set up my, my, mixer and all this, uh, you know, all my effects, everything.
And nothing's working. nothing's working. And I'm already on stage. I'm on the runway. The whole audience is looking at me and I'm just like,
Erik Weihenmayer: nothing to do, but panic.
Jeffrey Marshall: You don't see me do, but panic and you can't even panic because people are looking at you and so you just have to, and I don't even know what, how, what happened, but it just, I think it was just a miracle. It's just me just fleeting with, the forces of B. Please work. Cause it just miraculously just came on and then, and then you just perform, and you're like. But yeah, all these things happen all the time, all the time.
Erik Weihenmayer: And you just mentioned, by the way, performing alone.
So you have this amazing band, but you also perform solo. I heard, obviously on online, on YouTube, Strange Fruit, you doing that. It's just stunning, dude. So good that you're able to perform in so many different ways.
Jeffrey Marshall: Yeah, it's, I go back and forth because it's like being in a band, there's nothing like being in a band in, you know, and be, or playing with people.
It's, the camaraderie it's, but it's also.you've got to deal with this, like being in a relationship with how many people are in that. And you play with people a while and then you're like, okay, I don't want to play with people while I just want to do solo stuff.
And then you do solo stuff in a while and then you miss performing with others. You know, playing solo is great, but it's um,I always equate it to like, being an athlete, there's some athletics,that, you know, you have a team. And so when you win together,you're back in the locker room, you're celebrating with the team.
And then there's some, athletics where you're like, that you're just solo. Like I, I think like a fighter, like a boxer mixed martial artist, you know, that you go and then, and you win it, but you might have your coaches, whatever, but you win.
It's you that, either knock somebody out or gets knocked out, you know, it's you sitting in that locker room, either. happy about your victory or alone in your victory or alone in your defeat. I like playing solo, but you know, you have a great show and you're playing solo. And then after you get off stage, you don't, you don't have anybody to,you have the audience saying whatever, you don't have anybody to really just say, Oh, that was a great show.
Or, or, or what did we do and talk about it? I'm always about.analyze, like after I play a concert, with a band, like the next day we'll sit down in the band and we'll watch the footage and just talk about, you how we can make the show better.
Erik Weihenmayer: That's crazy. It is like an athletic event.
It is like a football team. That is cool.
Jeffrey Marshall: it really is. Yeah. I mean, and it's different when you're a performer as a solo, because I feel like as a, as an artist, I'm not, I feel like I'm one of those artists that never. It's satisfied with what I'm doing. I always feel like I always want to be better and always want to, you know, you know, and some, and sometimes, it's nice to have, other people that you're also creating with to be like, no, that was good.
I can get into my head as a solo artist a lot and be like, Oh, that was a horrible, you know, no matter how many times, it doesn't matter how many times, people in the audience will tell you, That you're, that you, that was great. it's always your own insecurities and your own self doubt about.
Erik Weihenmayer: It's the curse of somebody who's really driven. You know what I mean? Cause you want to be perfect and it's impossible. And then you beat yourself up. Yeah. I feel like I'm a little bit in that same camp. Hey, describe to me as a blind guy and those who haven't seen you play, like what that scene looks like.
You're lying down. You're playing the bass. I understand you have seven toes. So give us a little technical layout there of what's going on. Seven toes. That should be the name of your band. I like that.
Jeffrey Marshall: You know, actually, actually, that's what I often go by is seven toes. Really? Yeah. that's, yeah, that's one of my, one of my, it would be monikers.
Yeah. or yeah, that's exactly. Yeah, there's people in some place in the world that only know me as Devin Toast.
Erik Weihenmayer: Did I just stumble upon, I'm a marketing genius, and I just stumbled upon that idea. Nice.
Jeffrey Marshall: you just,I actually stumbled on it, you just, cause I am seven toes, you know, but yes, if I hadn't come up with that, then you would be the marketing
Erik Weihenmayer: genius.
I'd want the trademark. I'm telling you, So you're on your back and then you're,you're playing with your feet and I know you play the harmonica beautifully too and you sing really nicely. Oh my gosh.
Jeffrey Marshall: Well, thank you. So generally what I do is I have a,a platform that maybe that's up off the ground, maybe, uh, two or three feet.
And I lay on my side. And on your side. Okay. Okay. Got it. Yeah. on the side. Yes. I lay on the side and then, um, I'll have my microphone by the, by my mouth or harmonica, and then I'll have, and then, and then the guitar or the bass guitar will be at my feet. So yeah, literally like, uh, the music's going from head to toe, basically.
Erik Weihenmayer: Yeah. You know, so. Incredible. I met through my No Barriers, this amazing guy, Mark Goffiney, who was, they called him Big Toe. He was a guy, he was, arm amputee and he played the guitar with his feet and, uh, he passed away a couple of years ago, but
Jeffrey Marshall: No, I, I've, I've, I've heard, because there's not a lot of us.
Yeah, you're in a very small club. Yeah, no, I, yeah, he was from, um, San Diego, right?
Erik Weihenmayer: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. He was pretty amazing, talented dude. And, uh, It was really sad. But I know that you did some projects where you looked at the history of disabled artists and musicians. Are there some standouts for you over the years throughout history, throughout, I guess, modern history?
Jeffrey Marshall: Ooh, when I think of, disabled musicians, I think of, Stevie Wonder and Ray Charles were pretty much the, Yeah. They're the gold standard. Yeah. Yeah. and there has been, but I don't really. I don't know so many. I mean, I think like this, the generation that is, is, the young kids right now, I think that there's more disabled musicians now than there ever has been, there wasn't anybody that I'm, like I said, Not many people that I knew.
Yeah. I couldn't go, when I was learning to play, I couldn't go to a guitar teacher and say, I want to learn to, can you teach me how to play with my toes? Right. Because there was, there wasn't. That just wasn't what people even thought that was possible. So yeah, I didn't actually take formal lessons do many, many years after I've been playing.
That was just because, I started taking a jazz theory for a while, but yeah. So, I mean, there wasn't, there wasn't a lot of representation in the disabled world
Erik Weihenmayer: when I was growing up.
And you didn't have a roadmap either. So you started playing at 13 and like, I understand you had a passion for music, but like your story is really, I don't know, like the word I keep coming back to is kind of ballsy. At this point you have a passion for music, but then you want a guitar, a bass guitar. Did you have an idea, like in your head, like maybe I can play, you know, since I do so many things with my feet, maybe I could learn to play the guitar with my toes?
Jeffrey Marshall: You know, for me, it all happened very organically. I didn't think that it wasn't really until I was really established as a musician that people started, that I started realizing what I was doing was that different because I was just, I mean, you know, when you're a teenager, there comes a point when you're a teenager and all your friends say, Hey, let's start a rock and roll band.
And your friends, it's eight people are in the band. All your friends from the, you know, your class, whatever your neighborhood, whatever, they all started in, eight people starting in a band. by the end of that year, the band's only three or four people that really added a passion for it.
And when you're beginning to play, I think it's any musician, you know, you're just trying to, everybody starts off as horrible, you start off as horrible, and then.I would just look at, MTV, like everybody did in my generation, and be like, that's what I want to do.
You know, you just want, all the things that, that you see that, that glamor, glamorizes rock and roll lifestyle, you're like, that's what I want.
Erik Weihenmayer: Yeah, you're dreaming about that as a kid, you know, and hey, there's that, and you practiced a ton. And there's that song by Brian Adams, I've played until my fingers bled, you played until your toes bled. You worked hard, didn't you?
Jeffrey Marshall: I worked hard and I think one thing that was really uh, influential to me was, going... to high school and university in Nashville, Tennessee. I played with sons and daughters of musicians or artists that had successful careers. And so being in a place like Nashville, like nobody, cared whether I play with my feet or not. Right. They just care if you're good. And if you're not good, you don't get to play in Nashville, I don't ever remember somebody going, , that's so special because you play with your feet. They were almost like, okay, you gotta be better than people with their hands, and so that was the mindset that I grew up in. You've heard that, the devil went down to Georgia, song. Growing up, everybody was the devil and I was John.
So it was just, yeah, just not, and it wasn't out of arrogance or whatever. It was just about, Being able to get that fiddle of gold, so to speak.
Erik Weihenmayer: And being in Nashville. Yeah. It's like, it's such a creative melting pot of talent. It's sure, it must've been intimidating, but it also must've been amazing to be influenced by so many people that were mentors probably.
Jeffrey Marshall: Absolutely. I don't never remember being intimidating, but it was like, growing up, my favorite musicians were people that I knew, the people that I would go to school with or go to colleges or play in their band. Those were my favorite people to see or people to, my mentors were people that I knew much more than people that were already.
I mean, of course I had, of course,Jimi Hendrix or other people that were successful or whatever. But yeah, those, my, my mentors and people that inspired me most were people that I knew personally. And so that was really also very motivating.
Erik Weihenmayer: You described yourself. At that point, you had this young innocence and this rebellion, right?
That, we're all, like, when we're kids, we have that feeling, and you said you weren't intimidated, and it brings me back to this idea that,you could have easily, at that point of your life, just shrunk or, like, hidden from the world, but you did the opposite.
You really, turned into things. It seems like, At least in my mind, studying you, that's a piece of your success, is this ability to just turn into the storm and go for it. Like my hero, Terry Fox, back in the 80s, he was diagnosed with cancer and he lost a leg and he decides he's going to run across Canada and he becomes world famous.
He's like a folk hero in Canada and around the world because he made this decision to go for it instead of to hide. And so do you think there's something inside you? what do you attribute that to?
Jeffrey Marshall: I think I contribute to a lot of things. Like I said, I think a lot was the environment that I was, like my second live performance that I ever did as a musician was In front of 20 something thousand people.
Yeah. And, Crazy. You know, with, Yeah, with,I got to perform with, A widespread panic, Blues traveler, Dave Matthews band, In
Erik Weihenmayer: front of 20, 000 people.
Jeffrey Marshall: yeah, And that was my second concert that I ever did. How did that come to
Erik Weihenmayer: pass? Oh my gosh. You got to tell us that story.
Jeffrey Marshall: How it happened is that there was a, a concert, it was like, like Lollapalooza and it was called the Horde Festival. And it was a, a summer concert that happened every summer in the nineties and all, big bands, like I said, Widespread Panic, Blues Traveler, Dave Matthews Band, we're all playing that year and that year, particularly John Popper, who is a harmonica player and lead singer of Blues Traveler, he was in a motorcycle accident. And so I had managed to get backstage when they came to Nashville. And so I was backstage in my wheelchair and he was in a wheelchair because he had that motorcycle accident. And so he pulls up his wheelchair right beside me and he's, we were, making jokes like, okay, this is the handicap parking.
We were just laughing. And,and I was a huge, of course I was a huge fan of him and, we were talking and I just mentioned that I was a musician and he was like, okay. And, and we talked and whatever. And so that night ended and I was like, that was a really great experience, being backstage with some of the best musicians in the world.
And so fast forward to like two or three weeks later, I was hanging out with a bunch of friends and they were like, Oh, the last concert of the Horde festival is in Birmingham, Alabama.And so a bunch of us are going to, take a road trip to go to Birmingham, Alabama to go see, you know, and they asked me if I wanted to go and I was like, okay, so I don't know, it was probably a dozen of us, in a couple, in a few cars, we caravans from Nashville to Birmingham.
So I'm at the same handicap parking backstage. I managed to also blend on my way backstage again. And so I'm watching Blues Traveler perform. And as, they perform and as, John Popper was wheeling off the stage and he's Oh, Jeffrey, it's nice to see you again, and we were just making small chitchat and he was like, so, uh, so you're gonna, you're gonna play with us tonight.
You know, and I was like, Oh, absolutely. No, you know, and, and my friends that were around me were like, Oh yeah, he's absolutely going to play, I was like, no,good for them. so since it was the last show of the festival. all the bands do their set and then all for the encore, all the bands come up on stage and they do this, this big jam session.
And so, yeah, they asked me, to come up on stage. Like I said, Dave Matthews is right behind me. I'm playing all these people, you know, like, like I said, some of the best musicians. In the world and, and I got to be on stage and, they even gave me a solo. And then after I got off stage, the roadies had come up to watch me perform, they all gave me a standing ovation and I was like, okay, this is what I'm gonna do for the rest of my life. that was it. That was it. That was it. I'm, you know, you know, girls were kissing on me and I was like, this is great. Yeah, it was, yeah. So that was really what motivated me and realized that it wasn't a dream.
It was absolutely attainable. And I think if I, if I hadn't grown up in that environment, maybe it would have just been a dream. And maybe somebody would have told me, Oh, you can't do that. Or that's, you're, you know, you're not going to find any success in that, but people were very. encouraging and people that were also my mentors that were also very successful and had careers that were doing that were very encouraging.
Erik Weihenmayer: But it's so cool that you showed up, man. You showed up and you were there backstage when that opportunity awaited. It's like when I climb a mountain, you got to get in position and be ready for the summit. Otherwise you don't have a chance. So I think that story is so cool.
Jeffrey Marshall: Yeah,,
you can't make dreams come true if the only thing you're doing is dreaming.
Erik Weihenmayer: Right.
Jeffrey Marshall: There's gotta be a point where you dream, you have to wake up and you have to make that dream come true. And so I think that's what, I think a lot of people, they miss that because, they only, they're only doing the dreaming part of it. there's a lot of things, not the bleeding part. Exactly. Yes. Yeah.
Erik Weihenmayer: Hey, another question I have, which, you know, so when I was young, I would, I got a lot of attention as the blind climber, right? And in a way that becomes like a double-edged sword because you're like, am I the blind climber or am I person who loves climbing, happens to be blind.
What's your take on that? Obviously, you're an amazing musician and talent, but you have gotten some attention for just the extraordinary nature of how you play and your story. How do you wrap your head around that? Do you see yourself like as a musician who just happens to have a disability or do you think hey the disability is part of the show and part Of my story that I'm that's front and center How do you look at that?
Jeffrey Marshall: Yeah, you know me personally. I don't look at Any of that, I just concentrate on the work, just the body of work, the craft. gotcha. Um, you know, that conversation is for the audience to have within themselves. it's not really my, it's not, I don't, I just can't think about that,
Erik Weihenmayer: I think that's smart. Yeah, so you can just be the creative force and just do your thing and not get hung up with that at all.
Jeffrey Marshall: Yeah, you know, and I think it's different in different places. In my personal opinion, like I believe that performing and playing in the United States, like people have to make it that, like I've always said, like performing in America more times than not, if people say, Oh, I want to see that, like people in America, I believe want to see me play as opposed to like, in my experience in Europe.
They want to hear me play, so I think it's different in different places, but like I said, regardless. If you're going to pay to either hear me play or see me to play, it's my job just to put on the best show that I can.
Erik Weihenmayer: Yeah. I love that. You also are creative in the way that like you, it separates real musicians from campfire guitar players like myself.
You, you started writing music at a young age. I always find that incredible, to just be able to create something out of your mind and imagination. Do you remember the first song you wrote? First song that I ever wrote. Or one of the first songs you wrote?
Jeffrey Marshall: Actually, I think I do remember the first song that I ever wrote.
Um, it was, hold on, let me think about it. I'm trying to think. I think I can't even remember. It's like something like, I believe it was some song about, I ain't got time for school or something like that. It was something about school. It was something about hating school. Like, uh, how I didn't like school because I,ain't got time for school.
Can't get nothing done. I got time for school always on the run or something like this. Yeah, I think that was, I think that was the first time me hating school. it was the first song that I believe that I wrote. You got to break that out again. That's, I like it. Yeah, I would, I don't know. I think I remember the hook, but I don't remember, you know, I would have to, I would have to go,old cassette tapes to find that, somewhere in a box.
I don't even know. I probably, it's probably in my mother's attic somewhere. Exactly.
Erik Weihenmayer: So this next piece I want to ask you about, it's almost sounds like a side note, but it's like. It just keeps, continuing this idea in my mind that you're like, your life should be a movie, because at a young age you leave for this quote unquote freak show, like the last freak show.
You go to Venice Beach and,andwhat a wild, story that, that was.
Jeffrey Marshall: Yeah, it was, so I, how that happened,
Erik Weihenmayer: It was like the America's Last Freak Show or something. I don't think you ever actually were part of it, right? Because another job, just tell the story because I, I'll butcher it.
Jeffrey Marshall: Yeah, it was, so I had actually been, I was spending time in, in Europe and, and before I did this project, I would've, I was a person that would probably have never, I was really, conscious about, not trying to typecast myself in something like a freak show, but,I got a call from a director, by the name of, Simon Taten and he initially called me cause he was like doing a documentary about a freak show.
And basically he initially called me because he wanted to have a point of view from a disabled artist that's not been in the freak show about what I think about disabled people being in a freak show.
Erik Weihenmayer: Right. Right. And so
Jeffrey Marshall: That was initially why he contacted me to get my thoughts about it.
And then slowly over, over time, that became me being in a friend's show. And and I was absolutely, I mean, he courted me for a while before I said yes. And it just so happened. I was, I was going back and forth from, at the time from Europe to Nashville and I was traveling all around and, I was in Nashville and I was doing some work in New York city.
And just so happens that the freak show, uh, the time that I was free was in, in New Jersey. And so I was like, well, I have some free time. And I was like, and I was really so trepidatious about doing it. After time, I'm like one of those kind of people that if I'm really opposed to do something, then it kind of makes me more, it makes it more attractive to me.
Because I'm like, why am I so opposed to this? And so let me not be afraid of that and just tackle that. And so it was more of a exploration of myself and just to see what my own limits would be.
Erik Weihenmayer: I think it's a wonderful exploration of yourself. You say yes to things, even if you're not sure, that's what you do when you're young, right?
You go out and explore the world and what, where you're going to. fit in it,
Jeffrey Marshall: And yes, exactly. And so I did the, I did, so they did, I did the documentary and it was really, it was very, it was really well done. I was really proud of the documentary and just so happened,I don't know, sometime after that, I get a call from Todd Ray, who was, uh, he ran a freak show in Venice.
And he asked me if I wanted to come out and work it. And, and I was like, wow, I would love to live, live in Southern California. And every, everybody knows that how expensive Southern California is. And it's if I have a job already lined up in Southern California, how can I pass it up?
But I absolutely, I never spent a day working that because, they had a new building, a bigger space that they were renovating. And so I got to Venice and every week they're telling me, okay, we're going to open next week and we're going to open next week. And I'm just,bottoming out money, you know, cause I'm in California and I'm just, and and I, I was on the beach every day.
And somebody said to me, why don't you just lay on the beach?And I was like,I have my guitar. I'm just, I'm not doing anything. I'm just bleeding money. I'm already at the beach every day, just hanging out. And so I started performing on the beach and I started making more money probably in a couple hours than I would have made in a week working at the freak show.
And so it was like, wait a minute, this is going to be, I want to be my own boss. And so, um,
Erik Weihenmayer: That's the part of the story I love. You just turn it, you start performing, you're making more money than you ever would have made. And again, it becomes another door open in your life. That's cool.
Jeffrey Marshall: Yeah. It was,it was a great experience. It's crazy to live on, the environment of Venice Beach is a crazy environment. But,it was nice. I was making like, yeah, I was making very good money and I was just, just cash money in my pocket. and, you know, I was playing for I don't know, a couple hours a day and then, and then it would be great, you wouldn't have any money.
So you just go around the corner with your guitar and you just play. And then you'd be like, okay, Now I got party money, let's go hit up the clubs. And so it was great to just be making money like that.
Erik Weihenmayer: And the word freak, by the way, I think it's like a really interesting word because a lot of people, like disabled folks, you know, like my friend Mark Wellman, he always says, he uses the word gimp.
He's gimp power, man. And that becomes like a power word. And I interviewed a Broadway actor. She's in a wheelchair and she loves the word cripple. She's like, yeah, I'm cripple. And freak could be like the same thing, I feel It could be a power word. You're like, yeah, I'm a freak, but I own it. I've crushed the world, man.
I'm a great musician. Like, I'm just saying, these words, we can spin them around in a way to be a place of power of purpose or power in a way.
Jeffrey Marshall: Yeah, I think it's the same way, people of color, which I am a person of color,people of color use the N word. It becomes a, I think it's the same kind of concept. When I was younger, the word gimp used to be my trigger word, you know, when I was younger, it just, it used to be my, it used to be like, the same thing when, a person not of color says the N word to a person of color, it used to be my trigger word. You know, now as I'm older, I don't think I have, words that are, the only word that's a trigger word to me now is no. I don't like the word no. But yeah, I think it becomes, a word of empowerment, but I also think we live in a day and age where I think there's either words of empowerment or people just get like, you know, if you say the word disabled, people can get offended on some, saying, Oh, you're being an,an ableist.
Like for instance, so there is a, I don't know if you know this, but there is a group of people that are,I don't, there's men, but but specifically the group of,women. That are attracted to disabled people.
Erik Weihenmayer: Right, yeah.
Jeffrey Marshall: and they're called, devotees.
Erik Weihenmayer: I've heard this.
Jeffrey Marshall: And I was, and people were like, Oh, and you have the, a lot of people in the disabled communities are very disgusted by that because they're thinking, Oh, You're exploiting disabled people and blah, blah, blah.
And I'm like, I said, if somebody wants to have sex with me because I'm disabled, that's great. You know what I'm saying?I call them angels, you know? Why does anybody have a problem with that?
Erik Weihenmayer: Totally. We live in the world. Take the opportunities that come, that are in front of us.
Don't turn away.
Jeffrey Marshall: Yeah, no, don't, yeah, don't try to hate on a person just because. if you want to have sex with me because I have no arms and I'm in a wheelchair, then you know what? God bless you. You know what I'm saying? God bless you. but, so I think is that there's a catch 22. People, can get really hypersensitive about things and then people can just be hyper irreverent about things like, like word gimp or the word cripple, it just depends on, on, on who you talk to and, and what generation you come from.
I think it also has a lot to do with that. I think people from our generation, you have to, growing up disabled, you have to be a little bit, hard around the edges, you know?
Erik Weihenmayer: Yeah. You got to be a pragmatist.
Jeffrey Marshall: Yeah. nobody gave me a participation award for playing bass guitars by feet.
That wasn't even heard of, Yeah. I had to either be good or they kicked my ass off the stage. Yeah. So that was it.
Erik Weihenmayer: Love it. Okay. So continuing this theme of ballsiness, and we don't have a ton of time, unfortunately, because I don't want to keep you all day, but. Like, just want to point out, you moved to Venice Beach, you moved to Prague, you spent time in Thailand, so you're getting out there in the world.
Like I have this friend who's done amazing stuff,built organizations and just successful and he was a big climber and he wrote a book called Blind Corners and I just feel like that seems a lot to be your life. Obviously, huge intention. But you're not afraid to like, just go to Prague, not knowing anything about it with a disability and just places like that, that are pretty inaccessible.
Jeffrey Marshall: Very inaccessible.
Erik Weihenmayer: So yeah. So you just have a no kind of fear attitude about getting out there in the world, which I just, I find so cool.
Jeffrey Marshall: Well, I think that we, we are cut from the same cloth, my friend. You know? Yeah.
Erik Weihenmayer: No, I'm with you. I'm like right there with you. Yeah. The last question I have for you is maybe like a hard one, because I thought if somebody asked me this, I'd have no clue how to answer it.
But, so your life in a way, not to put like a context of faith on it, but it, just let's call it a, a miracle in terms of, so many things coming together. You got adopted by a really awesome family, so you had this, great family support and love. You have, musical talent, you have passion.
And, you have creativity, you have an ethic of hard work. You all these things coming together. and that just doesn't happen every day. So maybe that's just serendipity, but we talk at No Barriers about this No Barriers mindset, this No Barriers life. And is there like a pathway or is there a takeaway?
Is there a map that like, people can take away from a life of a person like you. Do you think there is a roadmap that people can understand through your life? Or do you think it's just shit coming together that was wildly fortunate?
Jeffrey Marshall: I think that, I think there's both.
I think that, there's a whole lot of things that would take place for me to be where I'm at right now. Some of those things were great. Some of the things were bad, some of the worst things that happened to you like lead to the best outcome. And, I've always had the mantra of just close your eyes and jump, you'll, you figure it out when you're in the air, you figure it out when you're in your air and where you land is where you land.
And like I said, to follow your dreams, you have to first wake up, get out of bed and go do those things, or else you're just dreaming, And so, um,and I love what I do and I love, and I'm not and I'm not finished. I haven't, I still think that my, my best work is ahead of me.
And so that's, you know, you know, just stay hungry for it. Stay hungry. I'm still, As passionate as I was about my art, about my music, about my film as was 13 years old.
Erik Weihenmayer: Amazing.And you're a filmmaker on the side. I'll have you back on another podcast and we'll talk just about your filmmaking because you have all these amazing projects that you've, accomplished through filmmaking. I can't wait to see you or quote unquote, see you, perform live. My dream, I'd love to drag you to a No Barriers event and perform. We'll talk about that, but man, it's just so wonderful to get to know you, to get a taste of your life and, and I just think, I think like this, close your eyes and jump.
I just think that's a really super cool theme that people should wrap their heads around. Maybe we overthink too much and paralyze ourselves and you seem to have bypass that. So that's amazing. best of luck. Have a great time in Thailand and, hopefully we'll meet in person soon.
Jeffrey Marshall: Awesome. Thank you. I appreciate, you having me on and yeah, I look forward to meeting you also in person and, I would love to come back again.
Erik Weihenmayer: Cool, man. Thanks. Thanks friend. All right. Thank you. All right. Bye bye. No barriers to everyone.
Didrik Johnck: The production team behind this podcast includes producer Didrik Johnck, that's me, and audio engineer, Tyler Kottman. Special thanks to the Dan Ryan Band for our intro song, Guidance. And thanks to all of you for listening. If you enjoyed this show, please subscribe, share it, and hey, we'd be thrilled for a review. Show notes can be found at NoBarriersPodcast.
com. There's also a link there to shoot me an email with any suggestions or guest ideas for the show. Thanks so much and have a great day.
